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Newbie Hangout - Backlink's

thegayestwebsiteever - 10:02 PM EST, Thursday Aug 14, 2008
Post subject: Backlink's

Hi Everyone,

It has been awhile and now I am back, we took everyones advice and started a blog and have generated alot of traffic and now have started to develop our Gay Adult Entertainment site. We have been going to gay prides in our geographical region this summer handing out fliers and promo codes for advertisement. We are now getting loads of people interested and our email list has grown to over 300.

We were wondering what are the best ways to get backlinks to our site to get a higher search engine ranking. We have tried sending out emails but to no avail most of them don't even get a response. This is very frustrating to some extent but kind of expected. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank You
George

The Gayest Website Ever

sexshopmall - 12:55 AM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
Post subject:

Just a few include...

A signature in a forum post or even linking to your site when relevant to the forum discussion

Paid advertising on a site using a text link. If you do this be sure that you are not placing your ad in an ad system that usse code that doesn't allow search engines to follow and credit your link back to you.

Write articles, columns, posts, etc to sites that allow it.

Many sites and directories have "submit your site" pages that will automatically add links back to you. Unfortunately, these links are often the least valuable links as far as SEO goes (although if it sends you traffic and customers then they still may be worth getting)

The best method BY FAR is to have a site that people want to link to in the context of the content of their own site. This takes more time but if you have a good website that people are "talking" about on their site you will get backlinks without doing anything extra.

Evil - 09:07 AM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Choose what keywords you'd like your site to be found from. Search on them in Google and Yahoo and then try to set up link exchanges with as many of them as you can.

Pay attention to Google PageRank too. Many people think it's not very relevant, but in my experience it is. If you can get a text link on a PR5 site, you will see almost immediate results from Google.

Hammer - 09:12 AM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Just in case you plan to post that banner in all of your posts I'd like to point out that we have sig rules on this site and posting your banner as part of your post to get around that rule is not appreciated.

P.S. Backlinks will not improve your SE rankings and I disagree with Chris. I've got sites with a PR6 that do great on Google, but they also did great while they were in the sandbox and had a PR0. I've never seen any evidence that PR has ever affected any of my sites. Follow good SEO techiniques and forget about PR.

thegayestwebsiteever - 09:58 AM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Thanks for the reply sexshopmall, I appreciate the input.

thegayestwebsiteever - 10:02 AM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Thanks for the replys Evil, and Hammer.

Hammer I am sorry I was unaware of this rule and will no longer post my sig in my posts. I do appoligize.

Thanks
George

khan - 10:40 AM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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George, if you look at the "Edit Chat and Picture Settings" under "Account Settings" from the Member's Menu (at the top of the page) you'll see the rules for sigs and sig graphics. They're in red to the right of that page.

Hope that helps.

Evil - 11:11 AM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Evil wrote:

Many people think it's not very relevant, but in my experience it is. If you can get a text link on a PR5 site, you will see almost immediate results from Google.

Quoted just for my friend Hammer.

My wallet agrees that PR is still important. Wink

thegayestwebsiteever - 01:28 PM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Thanks Kahn, appreciate it. Thanks again Evil.

Hammer - 02:25 PM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Evil wrote:

Many people think it's not very relevant, but in my experience it is. If you can get a text link on a PR5 site, you will see almost immediate results from Google.

Quoted just for my friend Hammer.

My wallet agrees that PR is still important. Wink

We'll have to agree to disagree on the PR issue.

As with anything, there will always be plenty of disagreement when it comes to SEO but I personally think that PR is about as overrated as Alexa rankings.

KevinG - 02:32 PM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Hammer wrote:

P.S. Backlinks will not improve your SE rankings and I disagree with Chris. I've got sites with a PR6 that do great on Google, but they also did great while they were in the sandbox and had a PR0. I've never seen any evidence that PR has ever affected any of my sites. Follow good SEO techiniques and forget about PR.

Here's my input since my friend Hammer was nice enough to point out this thread.

Backlinks = good. "Backlink is just fancy SEO-speak for inbound links.

1-way inbound links are worth their weight in gold, so to speak.

PR - doesn't fucking mean shit.

I have a PR5 site that makes $100 a month.

I have a PR4 site that makes $6,000 a month.

Hammer - 02:36 PM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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After rereading my first response about backlinks I see that what I said was not necessarily what I meant to say. I don't mean to say that backlinks aren't good to get and won't affect your rankings, my point is that backlinks will not in and of themselves do much for your rankings.

KevinG - 03:34 PM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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Hammer wrote:

Then we agree as usual. Wink

Just don't get me started on Alexa rankings. LOL.

kevqtmn - 07:16 PM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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When it comes to SEO advice, there are two people in this industy whose opinions I've learned to value. Both of them happen to have posted replies here. You guys know who you are.

KevinG - 07:26 PM EST, Friday Aug 15, 2008
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kevqtmn wrote:

When it comes to SEO advice, there are two people in this industy whose opinions I've learned to value. Both of them happen to have posted replies here. You guys know who you are.

All I know is that I just visited http://www.latinbabeindex.com and got a huge boner!

rockslammer - 02:01 AM EST, Saturday Aug 16, 2008
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Query = pussy eating contest

www.google.com

#1 www.heaven666.org PR4
#2 suicidegirls.com PR6
#3 www.killmyday.com PR6
#4 vids.myspace.com PR8

Page rank has been discounted in favor of relevancy in this algorithm's SERP return.

Hammer - 11:06 AM EST, Saturday Aug 16, 2008
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nude webcams

1. www.livenuderooms.com PR2
2. cams.com PR6
3. realcamgirls.net PR3
4. www.cyberxstream.com PR3
5. www.privatefeeds.com PR4

Number one is a PR2 and beat out not only a PR6 but they beat out cams.com.

kevqtmn - 05:43 PM EST, Saturday Aug 16, 2008
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KevinG wrote:

kevqtmn wrote:

When it comes to SEO advice, there are two people in this industy whose opinions I've learned to value. Both of them happen to have posted replies here. You guys know who you are.

All I know is that I just visited http://www.latinbabeindex.com and got a huge boner!

That is awesome to hear. The site accomplished objective #1 but did you pull out your wallet? LOL.

Seriously, I am glad to hear that my hard work made you "happy".

YoungHussyAlex - 09:34 PM EST, Saturday Aug 16, 2008
Post subject:

Hey guys. So should I actively seek out links from people as a priority? I heard that this is really important for long term success.

KevinG - 07:58 AM EST, Sunday Aug 17, 2008
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YoungHussyAlex wrote:

Hey guys. So should I actively seek out links from people as a priority? I heard that this is really important for long term success.

Just about all links are good. They just carry different weight. Even outbound links can help you if they are relevant.

There are so many low quality link requests that most webmasters like myself just ignore them.

When seeking out link requests, make sure they are with sites that are related to your type of content. You will have more of a chance of exchanging links and they will carry more weight.

The best links are 1-way inbound links, but they are extremely difficult to get.

Say hi to Logan for me.

KevinG - 08:09 AM EST, Sunday Aug 17, 2008
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By the way, links from forums don't carry any weight, nor do links from paid ads.

YoungHussyAlex - 04:25 PM EST, Sunday Aug 17, 2008
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Hey Kevin, Logan says Hi back. He says you were one of the first people to ever help him. Very cool. This business is awesome so far. I'm loving it. Ok sounds like I need to find some links asap. Smile

sexshopmall - 07:36 PM EST, Monday Aug 18, 2008
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Kevin, you are right on all counts because I wasn’t clear in my suggestion at the beginning of this thread. Links from paid ads can carry a lot of SEO weight but ONLY when done certain ways.

First I should clarify that when I refer to a paid ad I am referring to any time you pay money to another websites to get exposure and traffic to your website. I am not referring to rotating banners, ad brokers (text or otherwise), pop-anythings, etc.

I’ll explain with my reply to Alex…

Here’s how you could approach the process paying other websites to link to your site, younghussy.com, with ads created in a way that will not only encourage sales but also provide increased search rankings (using younghussy.com as an example):

1. Target the phrase you want to get search traffic for. Both the entry and main pages on younghussy.com contain “hardcore amateur” so I assume the audience being targeted is those people looking for sites about hardcore amateurs.

2. Target the sites you want to get links from with a strong emphasis on those sites Google considers the most relevant for the phrase you are targeting. IGNORE PAGE RANK. Google has already told you which sites they consider the most relevant hardcore amateur sites and you will get Google’s “opinion” by searching for “hardcore amateur” and viewing the results.

3. Find relevant sites that will accept your clever ad submission. Depending on the category, you may have to sort through a few (or a lot) of pay sites and affiliate sites to get to sites that will accept your ad but if you are diligent you will find some.

4. Contact those sites to discuss promotional opportunities on their site. Depending on the site, there are lots of ways to create “text rich” content for their site that they will like because it ads original text content value to their site. Discuss with them a price that will allow you to create a page on their site in which you will creatively advertise younghussy.com. For example:

• Write a review of younghussie.com
• Interview Alex about a topic relevant to the site you are advertising on
• Write an “objective” article praising your site
• Write an “objective” article slamming your site for being offensive to some group (we once published an article all about the worst and most offensive sites that you should avoid at all costs like maxhardcore.com, meatholes, etc…affiliate links included and converted some traffic)
• Write an article about anything else relevant to the site you are publishing on. Be creative within the context of their site.

Make sure all of your ads are text rich in the phrase you are targeting. Request that the site owner give you creative input over title tags, alt tags if you are including pictures, etc. Whenever we use this approach we provide all the code exactly how we want it. Not only will you have more control this way but the less you ask of the other webmaster the more likely it will get done, the quicker it will be added to their site, etc. Also (very important) be sure that the site you are appearing on links to your ad page or else it will never be spidered by the search engines.

All of the above is beneficial to search engine relevance. However, don’t forget that every person that clicks on your ad is also a potential customer of yours. “Pre sell” them as well with the idea that you want them to spend money on your site with the search engine part secondary. It’s a good rule of thumb to build pages for the humans while keeping the search engines in mind, not the other way around.

-----------------------

As for forums, I would consider them less valuable but some forum links will count and some will not. Also, pages tend to get shuffled down over time and lose relevancy so frequent posting is often required. I believe that much of these this is based on the coding of the forum itself but I am willing to be corrected on this point. Forums are not my area of expertise and if things have changed in the past year or two then I stand corrected.

KevinG - 07:52 PM EST, Monday Aug 18, 2008
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sexshopmall - it sounds good in theory, but I would really be amazed that you could convince the owner of a high quality site to let you do that.

I have a high traffic, content rich site that I sell advertising on. (It's mainstream and I am not trolling for advertisers with this post.)

The site has 100 #1 rankings for relevant terms, 6,000 unique visitors per day, and I sell ads from $500 - $1,750 a month.

You would have to multiply those rates times 10 for me to even consider doing a deal like you described.

No offense. It you can get deals like that, then good for you. However, those types of things need to stay up permanently to work for SEO.

The nice thing about good organic SEO is that the rankings usually stick and it is the gift that keeps on giving.

Traffic from paid ads stops when the ad budget is used up.

Another thing to keep in mind when paying for links that you do not want to be seen as paid is that it is technically considered black hat by G. You are taking a risk and so is the site selling the links.

Google needs to perceive everything as being natural. So if anyone decides to dip their toes in the black hat waters, tread lightly and infrequently.

KevinG - 08:03 PM EST, Monday Aug 18, 2008
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By the way, I noticed these guys are an advertiser here:

www.sin20.com

I have two podcast interviews on there about SEO if anyone cares to listen.

LA Jay has an interview on there two.
Here's the podcast page:
www.sin20.com

sexshopmall - 09:17 PM EST, Monday Aug 18, 2008
Post subject:

Kevin,

I so respect your opinion…

You are right. Contacting sites and convincing them to do something like I described is really hard and time consuming work. My suggestion to use these types of paid “ads” to get incoming links and traffic wasn’t a shortcut. It’s just one approach that we’ve found can be effective. As I know you are aware, getting to the top of search results for popular phrases can take lot of work and in some cases, not even where a webmaster should spend their time.

The #1 method of SEO is to build a comprehensive, quality site that is the best at what it tries to do. The search results will come. However, that doesn’t mean that there aren’t steps that can be taken to speed up or improve those results. Not tricks or secret techniques, just ways to be clever in the approach taken Smile

Also, what you say about the cost to advertise on your site I suspect will be different than on many other people’s sites because I’m guessing that you are good at monetizing your traffic. However, not everyone is. With a quick search you can find (for example) blogs that get a lot of traffic and that do well in the search engines yet earn all their money from AdSense (if they aren’t too adult) or a similar ad system if they are adult. Some of these sites can be getting a lot of traffic yet only earning a couple hundred dollars a month. Sites like these don’t take much convincing to get them on board with new promotional ideas because in some cases they have no idea how to make money from their traffic. This isn’t going to be a majority of sites, but definitely some will be up for anything that’ll earn them extra revenue.

------------------------------

And I agree 100% about black hat SEO. There is no future in building something that can be burned down in a flash. We have a site http://female101.com that was one of the sites that got hit when Dreamhost was hacked two years ago. They did some things to a lot of sites that Google didn't like and we were banned because of them. We went from 2,000 uniques a day to a few hundred a day. Even though the Dreamhost situation was big news and it clearly wasn’t our fault it still took us 6 months and a lot of emails to get unbanned (and even now we are still just under 1,000 uniques a day.)

sexshopmall - 09:18 PM EST, Monday Aug 18, 2008
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and I'm looking forward to listening to your podcast Smile

KevinG - 10:08 PM EST, Monday Aug 18, 2008
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sexshopmall wrote:

and I'm looking forward to listening to your podcast Smile

Cool man. You seem like you know what you are talking about.

Your post above this one was good. I just didn't want to make a big quote.

You are right that there are good opportunities out there where you can help a webmaster that is not so good at monetizing their site, while helping yourself too.

I do this myself, but it is usually in making direct ad buys in narrowly targeted niches.

Evil - 10:49 PM EST, Monday Aug 18, 2008
Post subject:

Can I just clarify why I think PR is important?

I agree with everyone (and their examples!) of how PR2 and even PR0 sites can sit higher in search results than sites that have much higher page rank. That's really not my argument.

What I do consider valuable is having a link on a page that is (especially) PR5 or higher if you can get it. Google looks at PR5s (and higher) at least once a day, and tends to quickly index any other site link that it can find on those sites.

So... in my own case, I rank very high in Google for a few of my blogs that are PR0 or PR1 because I have nice links on PR4 and 5 sites. I rank higher than PR4s or PR3s.

Is everyone properly confused now? Wink

KevinG - 09:17 AM EST, Tuesday Aug 19, 2008
Post subject:

Evil wrote:

Chris - I understand what you are saying and there's nothing wrong with it. I have the Google Toolbar and I look at the PR bar on every site I go to, just out of habit.

While you are correct in your observations, I feel that too many webmasters put too much emphasis on Page Rank. It's one small thing in a large amount of variables that effect rankings.

The other point I was trying to make previously is that rankings are only one part of SEO and doing business online.

My point is explained in the title of the seminar I put on last month at XBiz Summer.

"SEO - It's more than just rankings - The Three Main Goals and How to Achieve Them.

Good rankings alone are not enough to make your web site successful. The three main goals of SEO are 1) Rankings, 2) Click-through Traffic from the Search Result, and 3) Converting the Traffic to a Sale.

When I was asked what my favorite stats program is, I said, "my bank account".

Some webmasters act like PR is the end all be all when it is far from that. (I am not saying you are one of those webmasters.) That is why I pointed out that I have a PR5 that makes $100 a month. It has tons of good rankings too. I have a PR4 that makes $6,000 a month.

loganp8000 - 08:30 PM EST, Wednesday Aug 20, 2008
Post subject:

Hammer and KevinG, laying it out for us like I remember. Nice. Aloha guys. From what I can recall, links are an important aspect to consider when creating both links from your site and getting links to your site. Time to get some links!!

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